I heard the news on Twitter today, Verde Mexican Food is closing. I was bummed, surprised, frustrated and maybe a little pissed. I called my buddy Si Robbins for the scoop and was told that it was true. Apparently, they do a decent business during the day, but there really isn’t enough regular evening business to make financial sense for this gem of an establishment in what is supposed to be an up and coming area.
Early reports of Verde were overwhelmingly positive, the vibe was there and the excitement was sure to translate into success for some really nice people serving up some really great food. The tortillas are amazing, the food is fresh & tasty, and the place is one of those comfortable little spots that made me want to visit often. Well, at least I meant to visit often. Truth is, I’ve only been there 4-5 times. For me, I live in Tempe and it isn’t exactly convenient for me to just pop in any time I want. I guess I had assumed that people living in or near downtown were visiting there enough to keep the doors open. I had seen decent traffic during my lunch visits, but, apparently, that isn’t cutting it.
Home made tortillas from Verde were awesome!
Watching some of the recent talk online, it sounds like they may try to relocate. I’m hoping for a Tempe location. 🙂
David from the awesome Phoenix Rail Food blog had this to say in a recent Facebook comment about the closing of Verde.
“It’s incredibly frustrating. So many people talked enthusiastically about Verde before it opened, but far fewer turned out to support it on a regular basis. I was always surprised that Matt’s Big Breakfast, a block away, had lines outside while Verde always had empty seats inside.”
While I feel bad for the people that have put a lot of blood, sweat and tears into this project, the bigger story might be what is / is not happening in downtown. How long will it be before there are enough residents to support places like this?
Some urbanites say they don’t like places like CityScape bringing more suburban-style business to the area, that we should “support the little guy” and “shop local.” Guess what? There might need to be more big guys to HELP support the little guys.
I happen to really like a lot of the new things happening in downtown Phoenix. Several of my friends are doing a lot to raise awareness of places like Verde, Bliss and many other small, independently-owned places that have cool written all over them.
Unfortunately, is seems cool can get killed without enough people sharing the love…
RIP, Verde.
I lived a few blocks away and still only went less than 10 times. Where are all the downtown people? Why aren’t they eating at places like this?
I have been watching some of the talk online and I wonder if some of this responsibility should be directed at the owners. Maybe having a great place isn’t enough. Did they do a good job in marketing their business or did they assume people would just come? Did they reach out to the neighborhoods? Did they connect with people online or offer things to loyal customers? I truly don’t know the answer but it is an interesting point that has been raised.
I think you’re right about this one. Matt’s places have succeeded largely because Matt is well liked, and the same with Johnny and Sens. PastaBar and Breadfruit are so unique their marketing issues may have been a little easier.
I like the crew at Verde, but besides Twitter, I haven’t seen much from them, nor did they seem to take advantage of LBS specials or hell, even had a special night for downtown residents.
Perhaps Verde can learn from this and do it better if there is a next time.
They did do a good job connecting with their neighbors (or at least downtown organizations and groups). They provided great deals on catering local events (such as Get Your Phx) and were cool about remembering and respecting repeat customers and online fans (although no discounts or ‘freebies’).
One issue may be that they could have been TOO focused on this downtown/’hipster’ audience that they didn’t reach out to the broader business and dining community (i.e. I didn’t see them at the LFAZ Fall Festival this year) This is pure speculation, but it has been a factor in the failure of other downtown businesses.
Also, until DT becomes a more walkable place, business such as this will have a hard time surviving. It is hard to stay in business when even residents living 2 blocks away find it unpleasant to walk over.
Tyler, Yuri… Thanks for the input. This kind of stuff is really interesting to me.
I agree completely. It’s all about marketing. Even that picture about the place showed that it looked like a run down place from the outside at that Angle. If I was driving around looking for food downtown, I would instantly assume the place was shut down. A little bold paint on the cracked wall, with an ad or two, maybe a sign letting us know we can eat there, would have done it justice.
i wonder if Vitamin T had anything to do with the decision to close. Aaron May has much deeper pockets, a bigger reputation, and (indirectly) subsidized rent from CityScape. It would be hard for anybody to compete with the businesses going into the CityScape.
As for PR, it is interesting that it got little mainstream media attention—or mainstream attention at all…they were even snubbed by the Downtown Phoenix Partnerships.
I would hope that vitamin t didn’t have anything to do with their decision to close. Different audiences, different feel etc.
I wish there was enough in that area for both of these places to not only survive but to thrive. Heck, most major cities have far more restaurants than our downtown area.
I am not nearly as familiar with their community involvement as Yuri nor do I know much about their relationships with some of the downtown groups but I bet these topics would make for some interesting blog posts. 🙂
DPP snubs most businesses north of Fillmore, which is the northern boundary of its jurisdiction (with the exception of a special contract with the Downtown Phoenix Public Market.)
That being said, I don’t think Vitamin T can be blamed. It’s half a mile away and the food is fundamentally different. Surely, the Downtown of a major city so near the Mexican border can support more than one decent Mexican restaurant.
Guys, seriously: Verde wasn’t that great.
I’ve went there about 8 times and tried everything including the breakfast burritos on the weekends. On one occasion my food, both the pork verde and beans, were barely warm.
Some of the people working at the counter acted like they didn’t want to be there and did very little to make you feel welcome. This is something I’ve heard others talk about as well.
The acoustics and sound system on that shelving were annoyning (flat response studio monitors don’t belong in a restaurant.) Last time I was there they had 80’s hair metal playing. No, I don’t want to hear “Pour Some Sugar on Me” again. Ever.
Granted, I grew up on homemade tortillas so for me that wasn’t a big deal. Now that I think about it, their rice was not that good, and those recycled paper plates turned into soggy mush by the of the meal.
How about those wooden block seats? My ass would be so uncomfortable after I left.
Man, I can’t think of much I liked about the place other than the red beef and pork verde, both which can’t compete with Ritos.
Don’t blame their failure on downtown or it’s residents: the place was mediocre and the location was weak.
On a related note: I had lunch at Chaka Chaka for the first time today: They’re going to do good.
Thanks Jason.
I haven’t tried Chaka Chaka but might after this. Looks like it is down by Carolina’s. Interesting to think of how well places like Carolina’s have done for so long in comparison to Verde.
Well said Nick … as you said … this is EXACTLY why we also need more “questionable” developments like CityScape in Downtown
Thanks Dave. I appreciate you stopping by.
You have a great feel for what goes on in that area. Hopefully, we will be talking about another cool new place opening in CenPho very soon…
my god, more mega-projects like CityScape would be the death of downtown.
Is the Arizona Center a successful development?
Not a complete success, but not as big a failure as often claimed. Most space is occupied at the AZ Center, so from a real estate point of view, it’s probably a success. From an urbanist point of view, it has many shortcomings of course.
Sean, David…
I would probably lean towards a success if we are talking about the AZ Center and Verde. One is open today and producing revenue while the other is not.
Nick, thanks for quoting me. To think that someone actually found value in a Facebook comment! You should feel no guilt about visiting four or five times. That adds up to about once per month during the restaurant’s lifetime — not too shabby for a restaurant outside your own neighborhood. I think I visited seven times myself. My frustration is more with those who talked endlessly about this place before it opened but never made it there or visited only once or twice after its opening.
I do think that the restaurant probably could have done some things better. I don’t agree with everything Jason says above, but those muffled speakers bothered me as well. Regardless, I hope that if the place is resurrected, it will be in an equally con venient and accessible location. I cringed this morning when a friend suggested a relocation to rail-resistant Scottsdale.
David, I tend to find value in a lot of things you say, Facebook has nothing to do with that. 🙂
I did like the food and the type of restaurant. For sure there are things that could have been better but I have yet to find any “perfect” restaurant.
This is such a sad loss. I really liked Verde, the food, the ambiance, and the people.
The tortillas were insanely good, the food was really simple and good, and the guacamole was great.
I always had outstanding customer service there, the guys were always really friendly and proud of their store. This is truly a loss to downtown, I live nearby and went about once a week. I sincerely hope they open in a nearby spot, or anywhere really- I will follow- and so will others.
RIP Verde, I tip my 40 to your memory.
Thanks Max,
I get the feeling that most of the downtown people did like the place a lot.
I hope they open in another spot but part of the reason I went there ( in addition to good food ) was to support small business in that area. I thought the place had a good story along with their good food. To me, that makes a difference.
I’m thinking it was just a little too far away from a prime location. While it is in a “cool spot” there is not enough density and neighbors in the area to sustain business. That coupled with very low visibility and marketing issues are sure to sink any business.
I see more stock and success locating somewhere with more foot traffic and residents; say locating in the street level retail spaces at Alta Lofts. There are 3 residential “complexes” within three blocks of this area alone; Alta itself, The Met, and St. Croix Villas. Not to mention the being across the street from ASU campus (School of Nursing and Health Care Innovation) and the Arizona Center.
I’m thinking the look of the place didn’t help. With some of the buzz heard, I’d still be hesitant about entering a place that looks so unappealing.